Registered members do not see this advertisement! Remove it by signing up for free.
hyundai genesis sedan   hyundai genesis sedan

DIRECT LINKS: Genesis Sedan / Genesis Coupe / Dealer Reviews / Invite a friend!

Go Back   Hyundai Genesis Forum > Hyundai Genesis Sedan Forums - 3.8 V6, 4.6 V8, 5.0 R-Spec V8 > General 2015 Hyundai Genesis Sedan Discussion
Hyundai Genesis Forum / Magazine Advertise Help us help you! Calendar Today's Posts

Notices

General 2015 Hyundai Genesis Sedan Discussion Forum for discussions specifically regarding the second generation 2015 Hyundai Genesis Sedan that don't fit specifically anywhere else.

Hyundai Genesis Forum: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more
Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #31  
Old 02-19-2014, 02:54 PM
Aquineas's Avatar
Aquineas Aquineas is offline
Supporting Member
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8 Ultimate
View Aquineas's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Lake Conroe, TX
Posts: 1,422
Aquineas is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Remove this ad
Well when (if?) the US version of the AWD V8 version of the Genesis is released, I suppose it will settle the argument. I generally agree with Italia though. I don't think the BMW RWD-AWD comparison numbers are entirely comparable as BMW tends to under-promise and over-deliver on power, whereas with the 2012-2014 5.0 Genesis, I'm of the opinion that it's de-tuned slightly (particularly for torque). As Nissan has discovered time and time again when they have aimed for the M3 with the 350 and 370z, German horses are a lot stouter.

Personally, I'm estimating the AWD version of the Genesis will be about .1-.2s slower, so about 5.3 0-60, which is still pretty damned respectable.
__________________
Current Ride(s):
2015 Hyundai Genesis 5.0 Ultimate, Casablanca White + Beige Interior born 11/11/2014
2014 GMC Acadia

Sally Ride, an American Hero
Reply With Quote

  #32  
Old 02-19-2014, 03:04 PM
ksoze ksoze is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis/Equus In His/Her Dreams (Doesn't own one yet)
View ksoze's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 971
ksoze is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquineas View Post
I generally agree with Italia though. I don't think the BMW RWD-AWD comparison numbers are entirely comparable as BMW tends to under-promise and over-deliver on power, whereas with the 2012-2014 5.0 Genesis, I'm of the opinion that it's de-tuned slightly (particularly for torque).
There might be shift in the original argument happening here. There is no comparison between car brands being attempted here by me. The HP rating between the cars being discussed here are the exact same - the 535i and 535iX have the exact same engine (as does the 550i & 550iX), so how they rate them to other brands does not matter, it's the same rating between the two F10 cars models.

One will assume the new Genesis AWD and RWD model also share the exact same power plant, forget the viability of the rating. We do not have both drivetrain versions to gauge the 0-60 yet, so a similar platform may give some insight into the suggested "loss" of performance of AWD.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 02-19-2014, 06:02 PM
italiabrain italiabrain is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8
View italiabrain's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 496
italiabrain is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by ksoze View Post
Scusa Italian, you are incorrect. Tests show the X drive versions of BMW's cars to be faster 0-60, with the same HP. It is not really that surprising - in some cases the gearing is different in the AWD drivetrains and the added traction to all fours wheels on full throttle will slow up any anti-slip nannies from coming on resulting in quicker 0-60.

How will Hyundai's AWD versions fare? No idea, but based on other brands who use similar hardware (AWD), there may not be the gap you proposed. Even you agreed, quoting a MT test that had both BMW cars the same.
How am I "incorrect"? I never said the Xi was slower than the i. I said the BMW trend wasn't comparable to the Genesis trend because the BMW benefits from significant low-end torque as a result of forced induction that the Genesis does not have.

I also suggested that the Genesis was more likely IN MY OPINION to follow the trend of other NA cars with significant disparities in peak HP and low-end Torque such as the GS and Q50.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 02-19-2014, 08:05 PM
crepen crepen is offline
Getting familiar with the group...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 3.8 V6 Sedan
View crepen's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Bolton, ON, Canada
Posts: 74
crepen is on a distinguished road
Send a message via ICQ to crepen
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by italiabrain View Post
I agree with you on pricing considerations, but not on performance numbers:

The 535xi is underrated at 300hp and (if the previous generation is an indicator) the Genesis will be slightly overrated at 420. The actual difference at the wheels between the two is likely to be more like 80hp.

Same for 0-60. Apples-to-apples: Motor Trend has the 535xi at 5.5s while they have the RSpec at 4.8s. Adding weight and drivetrain loss on AWD the new Genesis V8 Htrac will probably be in the 5.1 ballpark. Different, but not worlds apart.
Sorry - you are right the 535xi is 300 not 241.

Still, you think that BMW understates by 20 and Hyundai over by 20 (or some such combo adding up to 40hp)? What facts do you have to support this? I don't buy it.

The G is bigger, faster, better kitted for less $. I have long been a BMW fan, but having driven recent BMWs (especially those on run-flats) the G is better suited to pot-holed CDN roads. It's not a fair fight.
__________________
---
2009 Genesis Sedan 3.8l V6 Premium (CDN) Titanium Grey w\ Black Interior
KDM Rear Logo, Wheel Caps, Steering Wheel, license plate bolts
Backlit scuff plates, LED lighting inside and out, trunk liner, silver brake housings, Weathertech Digitalfit floorliner, Omega steering wheel cover
ECB Rotors, Hawk HPS pads
K&N Air Filter
Summer: Bremmerkraft BR05 19" wheels w\ 245/45R19 Conti DSW
Winter: OEM 18" with 235/50R18 Hankook I*cept evo
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 02-19-2014, 08:53 PM
italiabrain italiabrain is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8
View italiabrain's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 496
italiabrain is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by crepen View Post
Sorry - you are right the 535xi is 300 not 241.

Still, you think that BMW understates by 20 and Hyundai over by 20 (or some such combo adding up to 40hp)? What facts do you have to support this? I don't buy it.

The G is bigger, faster, better kitted for less $. I have long been a BMW fan, but having driven recent BMWs (especially those on run-flats) the G is better suited to pot-holed CDN roads. It's not a fair fight.
On the Hyundai being over rated (at least vs industry standards), here's a comparison to a non-German car advertised as having 9 fewer horsepower than the Genesis:



Edmunds on the same dyno has the 535 at 277. 277 vs 364... That's a difference of 87. I think that makes 80 a pretty good guess, don't you?
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 02-19-2014, 09:11 PM
tompass tompass is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 4.6 V8 Tau Sedan
View tompass's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NJ/SC
Age: 72
Posts: 765
tompass is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Perhaps that has something to do with Hyundai downgrading HP numbers on 2015 models. I compared performance of Acura TL SH AWD to '13 Genesis 3.8. Genesis rated at 333HP and TL at 306HP but TL much faster 0-60.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 02-19-2014, 09:20 PM
Aquineas's Avatar
Aquineas Aquineas is offline
Supporting Member
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8 Ultimate
View Aquineas's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Lake Conroe, TX
Posts: 1,422
Aquineas is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by tompass View Post
Perhaps that has something to do with Hyundai downgrading HP numbers on 2015 models. I compared performance of Acura TL SH AWD to '13 Genesis 3.8. Genesis rated at 333HP and TL at 306HP but TL much faster 0-60.
I haven't checked this, but how close are they in weight?
__________________
Current Ride(s):
2015 Hyundai Genesis 5.0 Ultimate, Casablanca White + Beige Interior born 11/11/2014
2014 GMC Acadia

Sally Ride, an American Hero
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 02-19-2014, 09:29 PM
tompass tompass is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 4.6 V8 Tau Sedan
View tompass's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NJ/SC
Age: 72
Posts: 765
tompass is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Acura TL SH AWD 4001 Genesis 3.8 3824
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 02-19-2014, 10:03 PM
italiabrain italiabrain is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8
View italiabrain's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 496
italiabrain is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Quote:
Originally Posted by tompass View Post
Perhaps that has something to do with Hyundai downgrading HP numbers on 2015 models. I compared performance of Acura TL SH AWD to '13 Genesis 3.8. Genesis rated at 333HP and TL at 306HP but TL much faster 0-60.
I think downrating on the 2015 is just that. I would bet that on the dyno it actually gains a little bit of power (dual intake and increased compression ratio seem like definitive positives). I think they're just moving toward the industry standard in terms of how they rate it. I'm betting the dyno line will move up to match the peak HP of the M56, and the advertised rating is also moving down to match it.

I haven't seen weight numbers for the 2015 Genesis in US spec 5.0 yet, but if the weight gain is minimal I wouldn't be surprised if the 275 rears and increased low-end torque shaved a tenth off the 2013 times.

I didn't think the TL was that much faster, at least not the automatic. Allow for an AWD clutch dump and the TL might do 5 flat, but I've seen 5.5ish for the auto.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 02-19-2014, 10:15 PM
tompass tompass is offline
Been here awhile...
Drives a Hyundai Genesis 4.6 V8 Tau Sedan
View tompass's Photo Album
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NJ/SC
Age: 72
Posts: 765
tompass is on a distinguished road
Default Re: 2015 Genesis Pricing, a bit more

Yes, 5.5 for the TL SH AWD is about right but I have also seen 5.3 and 5.4. Don't think the Genny 3.8 can get there. I know the 4.6, which I have, is advertised at 5.3 but not so sure that is attainable unless completely defeating the ESC. So how can the heavier TL perform better than the lighter Genny with more advertised horsepower? 333/305.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks
Download the Cars Connected app
Tags
2015, bit, genesis, pricing


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:44 AM.


Hyundai Genesis Ads
Remove this column

My Pledge

buy a genesis winged badge emblem

cars connected social network cars connected social networking app for ios cars connected social networking app for android






Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
GenesisOwners.com recognizes that "Hyundai", it's logos and various model names and numbers are registered trademarks of the Hyundai Motors Corporation. These terms are used for identification purposes only. GenesisOwners.com is not affiliated in any way with the Hyundai Motors Corporation, Hyundai or any other company listed herein. All information on this site is the opinion of its members and not the opinion of the site itself. 2015 Madison Ross Media Group. All rights reserved.
MADISON ROSS MEDIA GROUP MARKETPLACE
Need products for your Hyundai Genesis? Check out your options at the links below:

No special deals available at this time...